When does a car cease to be

2987 Views 12 Replies 4 Participants Last post by 1969ssclone2B, Oct 21, 2005

69NovaSS

Discussion Starter · Oct 19, 2005

Here is a question that has been asked many times on many boards but I thought I would try it here.

Lets just for argument sake here say we have an original documented without a doubt 1969 L78 SS Nova 4speed car. BUT it is in rough, very rough shape.

How much of this car can be replaced to repair rust/collision damage etc. (and no I am not talking about a rebody or swapping vins or anything like that) But how much of the body of the car can be replaced with either repoped parts, NOS parts, or good used parts before the original documented BB car is nolonger here?

This topic, I suspect, if people participate in the disscussion should be interesting to say the least.

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1969ssclone2B

· #2 · Oct 19, 2005

well im new to the nova scene...i have 2 other chevy's..camaro,truck....now i got my hands on a 69 nova..L6..base model i supose..im converting it to a ss clone..id love to have a ss matching numbers..and if i had a matching number ss. body rotted...holes and heavy damage..i would do anything to get it restored.check if the frame is straight..evrything from the firewall forward can be replaced or metalworked... new floorpans are a quick weld in..doors are everywhere!..skins or the whole door..new and used..rusted or wrecked roof?..get a rusted out parts car and cut the roof off and weld it up to the ss..and strip the rest of it and put the parts on ebay..you can get rear quarter panels..new or used......i think that a #'s matching 69 ss....is worth the trouble...ss clones are going for around 18.000...so im sure a reall ss is alot more.....ANY 69 chevy ss is rare as hell in the first place!!....thats my 2 cents....later!!

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1969ssclone2B

· #3 · Oct 19, 2005

ps......ill take ....good,cheap....suspended license.4 speeding tickets in the past 2 years...i dont need to go fast...lol

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· #4 · Oct 20, 2005

if the firewall's intact... the car is "The" car

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WILMASBOYL78

· #5 · Oct 20, 2005

More original is always better than less..in today's craziness all you need is the original cowl and a few other rusty parts and you have an "original". I assume by documented, you mean build sheet, POP, etc. If major surgery is required than the work must be "first rate". The worst thing is to have a car that really looks "put together". I would be reluctant to perform this level of resto if the car did not have most of the original driveline. Others may have diff ideas...

wilma

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69NovaSS

Discussion Starter · #6 · Oct 20, 2005

WILMASBOYL78 said:
More original is always better than less..in today's craziness all you need is the original cowl and a few other rusty parts and you have an "original". I assume by documented, you mean build sheet, POP, etc. If major surgery is required than the work must be "first rate". The worst thing is to have a car that really looks "put together". I would be reluctant to perform this level of resto if the car did not have most of the original driveline. Others may have diff ideas...

wilma

Ya pop, etc is what I mean by documented...this is all just a hypothetical question...I only wish I had one of those cars....Ya I have a GM Canada Documented '69 SS L48 Nova.....Sadly not the original motor (not sure yet abotu diff or trans) and it was mini tubbed and had the frame narrowed by a previous owner...so really does the fact it is fully documented and can be proven as to what it actully is/was make a difference..I guess in this case it makes little difference. Oh well I still like it

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69DUECE

· #7 · Oct 20, 2005

I look at it as the firewall, door post assembly, and main floor pan assembly all the way back. That is the basic stamping for the unibody car. Rust or no rust.

Most of the secondary VINs were stamped on the firewall, but some cars do have the VIN stamped on the door posts between the hinge points. Depends on which year, which plant, which line, etc. That takes the carcass past just the cowl. The build sheet is often stuffed in the interior. If youhave that, you have GOLD.

An unaltered ad unattached VIN plate is the next little detail. A pop riveted , glued, taped, missing VIN TAG qualifies it as a potential liability in my book.

Ditto a car that has been "transported" via a title service to Alabama or some other Half Baked effort to title a car. If you can't show me proof of owner ship. I don't wan't it.

For anybody having ruffeled feathers over these statements put yourself in the shoes of one that has had there car stolen after countless hours and dollars of effort. First stop on my restorationof my 69 was to pull the heater core cover at the firewall and expose the 2 hidden VINS. I was fortunate.It all matches. Yeah, its a SALVAGE title- but I know where its been, who had it, and where its going.

The 71 and up cars have door tags that are VIN specific. of course, those are easily faked. No Proof there.

Seatbelts from one car can be moved to another- with or without correct date coding.

Engines/trans/rear end for that matter same deal

Up to the owner to part or to restore or just preserve for another to restore.

Like I always say-IT AIN'T LIKE YOU CAN BUY EM AT WALMART ANYMORE!

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1969ssclone2B

· #8 · Oct 20, 2005

so the answer to the original question is.....the tags make it an ss?..cause the numbers dont lie....new parts or old....legally its still the same car......its alot better than just saying .''its not worth it''....and calling up the scrap metal driver for a pick up........cause if you restore it right....you showdnt be able to tell the difforance between old or new.....correct?..so in my opinion....as long as the numbers match...and the vin tags have not been tamperd with.....it will always be a ss...i dont care if its 80% new reproduction parts....it will ALAWYS be an ss

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69DUECE

· #9 · Oct 21, 2005

There ya go!

No "Top Flight Survivor" catagory necessarily but DEY IS WHAT DEY IS!

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69NovaSS

Discussion Starter · #10 · Oct 21, 2005

69DUECE said:
There ya go!

No "Top Flight Survivor" catagory necessarily but DEY IS WHAT DEY IS!

That I agree with fully....the car is what the car is...whether or not it is still fully original, day 2, or day 1000 (if ya get my drift) it is still what it is...

BTW sorta along this lines...quite a while ago there was a Yellow Yenko duece that was forsale on Ebay that was REALLY REALLY rough, not even sure that the drivetrain was complete.

But the back half of the car was really rotted underneath frame rails, trunk floor, quarters, etc just basicly gone....along with all the other issues the car has...I think the bidding got over 20 K and still didnt hit the reserve...

Anyway this car would need, JMO, something like 35-50K, maybe even more, worth of work to bring it around...I hope I'm not offending anyone here if they did eventually buy this car but is it worth it to spend that much for basicly a VIN number and a firewall and then to have to build a new car around it? What are the Yenko dueces going for today?

Just wondering is all...Not that I will EVER have that kind of money to spend on a car....

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69DUECE

· #11 · Oct 21, 2005

I saw that auction too,

I have to think that car restored would be in the 100 k catagory soon the way prices are going.

Rear rails can be replaced. rear inner fenders....outer fenders.....trunk drop offs.....floor pans.......all in the hands of a good welder and fabricator are all in a days (or months) work. I couldn't do it, but there are people that can.

If it was a straight six grocery getter in such sad shape.....instant 300 dollar donor car. What a difference a birthright makes.

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69NovaSS

Discussion Starter · #12 · Oct 21, 2005 (Edited)

69DUECE said:
I saw that auction too,

I have to think that car restored would be in the 100 k catagory soon the way prices are going.

Rear rails can be replaced. rear inner fenders....outer fenders.....trunk drop offs.....floor pans.......all in the hands of a good welder and fabricator are all in a days (or months) work. I couldn't do it, but there are people that can.

If it was a straight six grocery getter in such sad shape.....instant 300 dollar donor car. What a difference a birthright makes.

Ya it can all be replaced without a doupt...the rear of this car was sitting on a big beam and the car was actully starting to sink around the beam...Still not sure what the owner then wanted for it but from the talk back then people were saying he wanted 30K there abouts for it....

IMO a doner would be the way to go...with something like that cause some of the parts it needs are not being repoped yet...such as the frame rails...

Anyway it is a big project and IMO the only cars that justify that extensive of a rebuild after paying so much just to get the car in the first place is a COPO, yenko, motion, harral etc type car. There just isn't enough innate value in the other Novas (SS or not BB or not) to justify a 20K++ shell that needs 30K++ in work....but again JMO.

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1969ssclone2B

· #13 · Oct 21, 2005

its crazy!!!!!..ive seen on ebay saying that there selling an ss nova....396....then i scroll down to the vin#...and its just like mine.....113279----chevy--chevy 2/400/L6---2door--69...dont they know people can get all the info from the vin?.....all my numbers match....so im thinking after i finish cloning it..i might rebuild the L6..and trans..just to keep the matching parts......im thinking of going 4 speed....

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