which steering box [Archive] - Nova Tech

: which steering box


jrwnova
Oct 2nd, 09, 07:26 PM
im looking to replace my steering box and im wondering which other steering box will work with my 1970 nova

Big Dave
Oct 3rd, 09, 02:26 PM
Just about any car made by GM with rear wheel drive except the Corvair and the Vega-Monza; even a lot of light pick-ups use the same Saginaw 800 or 650 steering box that will interchange. That being said there are internal differences in turning radius (how far apart the stops are adjusted to inside the box) and the number of turns lock to lock (the gear ratio which can be changed by swapping parts inside the box) and the out put shaft diameter (number of spines but there are a plethora of different steering arms the same length with the correct spline count to fix that as well). everybody wants the steering box off of the 1985-'87 Monte Carlo SS as it is a quick ration tight turning radius box with power steering. However the Impala and many other cars shared the same box and are cheaper to buy due to the lower demand.

Big Dave

jrwnova
Oct 3rd, 09, 04:39 PM
im looking at the autozone website and thinking about getting the steering box out of a 1987 chevy monte carlo with a 5.0L OHV with a Steering ratio: 3.5 turns lock to lock any good?

Big Dave
Oct 3rd, 09, 05:13 PM
Keep in mind it has O-rings on the gear box instead of the SAE compression fitting so you will need an addapter if you are putting it on an older car with SAE type hoses. The Monte Carlo box is a very popular item but like I said the same box was used on a bunch of cars so do not pay a premium price for it if the Impala box is cheaper (have no idea on how the price structure works at Auto Zone but in junkyards if everyone wants an Monte Carlo box they will pull one off an Impala mark up the price and then sell it to you as the 'better' Monte Carlo box you asked for (to them it is the same Hollander number just comes with more profit).

Big Dave

jrwnova
Oct 3rd, 09, 07:00 PM
well the engine i'll be using is out of a 90 chevy and has a power steering pump with the O-rings hoses all ready im just concerned that the tires won't turn enough or too much, or do they all turn the same amount and the only difference is the ratio?

Big Dave
Oct 3rd, 09, 11:21 PM
Like I said the stopsd (what keeps the tire from hitting the frame) is an adjustment inside the steering gear box so you want to be carefull on selecting turning radius that you do not get a box that will have your tire scrubing the frame all the time. A short turning radius is a function of wheel base as well as angle of the turn, so a short wheel base car like the C2 Corvette or a mid sixties van will not turn the wheel as much as a station-wagon or full size crew cab pick-up with a long box which will have a really long wheel base and need to crank in a lot of steering input to get it to turn inside of the basin reserved for such barges.

Big Dave

Philip
Oct 4th, 09, 03:22 PM
well the engine i'll be using is out of a 90 chevy and has a power steering pump with the O-rings hoses all ready im just concerned that the tires won't turn enough or too much, or do they all turn the same amount and the only difference is the ratio?

A 90 Chevy......what model? car, truck, van??

jrwnova
Oct 4th, 09, 03:31 PM
its out of a 90 chevy Blazer

Philip
Oct 4th, 09, 03:47 PM
im looking at the autozone website and thinking about getting the steering box out of a 1987 chevy monte carlo with a 5.0L OHV with a Steering ratio: 3.5 turns lock to lock any good?

That unit is a variable ratio gear and will be nicer for daily driver type driving than the quick ratio gears. What is your reason for changing the steering gear? If it is just for hose compatibility the fitting in the newer steering pump can be changed to the inverted flare fitting in your stock pump.

The internal stops are not adjustable per se. On the inside of the bore is a steel ring in a groove that determines the stop by the ring thickness. The end cover casting depth is the stop on that end. By installing the cap and ring from the stock box into the donor housing or the internals from the donor into the stock housing proper turn radius is maintained.
To check if the stops will be correct in any gear compare the degrees of movement on the pitman shaft to the stock gear. If the new box moves at least the same amount you will be fine, if it is less than the turning radius will be affected.

Philip
Oct 4th, 09, 03:49 PM
Blazer gear will not work. If it is a full size it bolts to outside the frame and if it is an S10 it is a 605 gear.

jrwnova
Oct 4th, 09, 03:51 PM
mine was leaking bad and i couldn't rebuild it so i need one as soon as possible and autozone needs me to order it and could take too long and i can pick one for a monte carlo today for $35 cheaper

Philip
Oct 4th, 09, 04:13 PM
The splines on the shaft that the steering coupler slides onto is different, plus you will need to change the pressure hose and return pipe. Overall installing that gear will not be a bolt on, the extra parts will cost more than $35 and you still will not have the car running sooner than waiting for the correct gear.

Where do you live? if within driving distance to my house I have several good steering gears that will bolt on you can have for free.

jrwnova
Oct 4th, 09, 05:03 PM
no i live in NY...so if i get a steering box for a 87 monte carlo and put the end cap and ring from mine then the only thing i have to worry about it the hoses and the input shaft going to the steering column?

Philip
Oct 4th, 09, 05:24 PM
Where is it leaking from?

If you are going to disassemble one, just fix the one you have. If you do not have the proper tools you will not be able to get it back together again,especially all those little balls :D

http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j199/64elcamino/77%20Nova%20project/front%20end/P1010017.jpg

jrwnova
Oct 5th, 09, 11:32 AM
well i took mine apart and got the rebuild kit for it and couldn't put it back together i also broke one of the seals trying to put it back together so im looking for a replacement one or someone that can put it back together for me but now one does it by me so thats why im thinking of the monte carlo one

frochevy
Oct 5th, 09, 08:31 PM
I have a similar question. However, my 72 Nova has worn out manual steering box on it. I plan on using a regular older style pump I have laying around. I was going to look for a stock Nova power steering box. But with my chevelle project I'm using a Jeep Grand Cherokee steering box for faster ratio. Is there a box that will work with the nova that is a little faster ratio? Or should I just look for a stock Nova steering box?

Thanks!

Big Dave
Oct 5th, 09, 09:14 PM
An important thing to remember when interchanging Saginaw gearboxes is to use your original pitman arm and idler arm if possible, to maintain the proper steering geometry. Different body styles have different length idler and pitman arms; for example, the F body arms are longer than those in an A or G body and could cause alignment and front-end clearance problems if used in different body styles. When interchanging between earlier and later GM (after 1983) gearboxes, you will notice the power steering hose fittings are not the same. Newer fittings are metric and incorporate an O-ring, and all sixties and most early seventies boxes used the standard SAE inverted-flare fittings. Your local corner auto part’s store can sell you a standard thread to metric thread adapters in several different sizes that allow you to use your original hoses with the later-design metric gearboxes. The rag joint or steering gear coupler may also have to be changed. These can be obtained with the gearbox when being pulled from the donor car, or new ones are still available from the GM dealerships. The coupler off a 1977-and-up Chevy pickup (GM part number 7826542) works just fine to adapt the early-style steering shaft to the later model gearbox.

Manual steering gear boxes used a Saginaw 525 box.

Hollander Interchange #706 for Saginaw 605 in a:

Buick Special 64-70 Camaro 67-74 Chevelle 64-70
Chevy 65-70 Firebird 67-73 Grand Prix 69-70
Monte Carlo 70 Monza 75-79, 8cyl Monza 78-80,6cyl
Nova 68-70 Olds 64-70 F-85 64-70
Pontiac 64-70 Skyhawk 75-80 Starfire 75
Starfire 76-80, 6 cyl Starfire 77-79, 8cyl Sunbird 76-80
Tempest 64-70

Fast Ratio Box: 20/1 # 7806396 Cast No. 5679142
Monza/Vega Box: 16/1 # 7819935

On some 64-70 the drag link hole on the pitman arm may need to be enlarged.

The following boxes will fit but may need to have the pitman arm and/or the rag joint changed or and extra bolt hole boss taken off the steering box. Make sure you compare the input shaft length or the length from the bolt holes to the end of the input shaft to your power box.

Hollander Interchange #999 for a 605 steering gear box in a:

Apollo 73-75 Omega 73-79
Chevelle 71-77 Skylark 75-79
Monte Carlo 71 Regal 73-74
F-85 71-72 Nova 71-79
Lemans 72-77 Cutlass 76
Ventura 71-77 Phoenix 77-79
Century 73-74 Tempest 71
GMC Sprint 71-77
Cutlass 73

Hollander Interchange #989

AMC Ambassador 70-2
AMC 77-80
AMC Spirit 79-83
AMC Hornet 70-77
AMC Concord 78-83
AMC Matador 71-76
AMC Gremlin 70-78

Interchange #1034

Jeepster 72
Jeep 73-83
Jeep CJ & DJ 72
Jeep CJ 84-86

List was derived from Hollander Interchange Manual

Fast ratio Power Steering- Saginaw 605

Use box from 1977-81 Camaro/Firebird with disc brakes (or any 800 series box used in Novas, full size GM, etc), gives approx 3 turns lock to lock, versus original power steering 4.5 turns.

All later model boxes require the 1964 - 72 Chevelle pitman PS arm (required change) when used on earlier Chevelles.

Steering shaft comes in two diameters, get the appropriate flex coupling lower half in the same style as original to match the boxes shaft.

1982 or 86 to 92 Camaro Z-28/firebird Trans-AM are 2 turns (12:1) lock to lock, Use original end cap to get the right stops on 2 turn boxes to decrease turning radius.

Later model boxes (1980 and up) use "O" rings instead of flared input and output lines.

Later model internals can be swapped into early boxes to eliminate problems with line fittings and stops or pump can be modified by changing outlet valve (this requires verification) or swapped to accept "O" ring hosed.

The Saginaw gearbox is a rotary-valve type unit using recirculating ball bearings. They are referred to as recirculated ball-type because they use the same ball bearings on both the worm gear and the sector gear to reduce friction within the housing. You will often see this gearbox referred to as an "800" or "605" unit. The only major difference between these two units is how the pitman shaft is held into the unit. An 800 unit has a four-bolt cover on the top of the unit (the end of the shaft opposite the pitman arm spline). The 605 units use a single snap ring that holds a round cover into the top of the housing. GM also used two gearboxes, depending on the weight and size of the model. Station wagons, full-size cars and large front-wheel-drive cars used a heavy-duty gearbox usually identified by GM part number 5687962. These units had a 3.5-inch piston diameter, and the pitman shaft will turn anywhere from 3.5 to four turns between fully locked left and fully locked right. These units were rated at a 17.5:1 steering ratio. Mid-size and smaller models used a steering box tagged 5691676, and these units used a 3-inch piston. The travel on the smaller-piston unit was three to 3.5 turns lock to lock. The mid-size gearboxes were rated at a 14.4:1 steering ratio. Both the 3.5-inch and the 3-inch-bore gearboxes have a .813-inch input shaft diameter, and most will have 31 splines on the input shaft. You can substitute between both of these units. Aside from the mounting bolt pattern (most are 4-bolt mount but there are two different three-bolt mounts, as well), these units are all interchangeable. The more responsive 14.4:1 ratio gearboxes replaced the earlier 17.5:1 ratio boxes in most models by 1973. This is a good thing to remember when you begin your search for a replacement.

Saginaw 800 Power Steering Gear Box interchanges with :

1964-'76 AMC
1961-'76 Cadillac, including
1963-'76 Eldora do
1964-'76 Buick and Pontiac full-size cars and Riviera
1973-'76 Regal
1975-'76 Skyhawk, Seville, Monza and Starfire
1965-'76 Chevrolet full-size cars
1967-'76 Camaro and 1968-'76 Nova
1964-'76 Chevelle, Cutlass, GTO, Grand Prix, Lemans, Ventura and Tempest
1971-'76 Vega and 1975 Pontiac Astre
1960-'76 Oldsmobile full-size cars including 1966-'76 Tornado
1971-'76 Jeep Cherokee, Wagoneer, Gladiator and J-series pickups
1972-'75 International Scout and Traveler

The 1969-'76 Camaros as well as 1964-'76 Chevelles, Malibus and Monte Carlos also used an optional quick ratio 12.7:1 unit, which will interchange with the higher ratio gearboxes. These are very popular units because they are an easy bolt-in performance conversion. They were original equipment on 1983-'88 Monte Carlo, 1983-'84 Hurst Olds, 1985-'87 Olds 442, and 1984-'87 Buick Grand National or T-Type. They are also 12.7:1 units and a little more difficult to find, but can be identified by a "YA" marking on the end cap (opposite where the steering column attaches) or by searching for cars with the F41 or Z65 suspension package. All of the Monte Carlo SS cars had these options. These units will reduce steering wheel revolutions from lock to lock down to 2.25 to 2.75 turns.

Big Dave

jrwnova
Oct 9th, 09, 06:10 PM
the part number for GM 7826542 is longer used can someone help me out

Philip
Oct 9th, 09, 10:07 PM
One of these will work with no modifications. Install the stock fitting into the steering pump outlet instead of the O ring fitting and you will be good to go.

rebuilt power steering gear box (http://www.autozone.com/autozone/catalog/parts/partsShelf.jsp?displayName=Steering+Gear+%28Power+ Steering%29&currentPage=1&categoryDisplayName=Suspension+%26+Steering&navValue=14600599&itemId=599-0&parentId=46-0)